I do self host a bunch of stuff but i really don’t want to run my own email :(

A lot of Nazis were supposedly born in 1988…

But in this specific case, i believe him.

They did delete the posts, at least. Not great but at least an acknowledgement that maybe this isn’t a good look for the company.

Ah, okay. That makes sense. (Fwiw I’ve seen fascist types use 88 and 1488 outside the US, too. “88” is technically German. It can have begin meaning outside the US/The West in general, though.)

I’d still go with proton over Google. Google is also on board with fascism. Maybe not as enthusiastic about it but I’m not sure that’s a difference.

That said, looking for alternatives may be good.

That’s naive. I’m not ditching proton yet, personally, but this does shake my confidence in them.

The Biden government was targeting them, though. Kind of. Various companies were facing challenges from the administration. I think the difference is: If they suck Trump’s dick enough he’ll leave them alone. Biden was less likely to do that. Or probably that’s their view of it, anyway. Somehow big business seems to view Trump as a “rational actor” while they view Biden as the opposite.

Something something TOS Mirror Universe episode…

…88 is a red flag. Generally that’s a bad number.

I’ve had an ADP employer in the past and when i tried it prompted me for some additional personal info so this did not work for me.

It’s also not automatically end-to-end encrypted (as i understand it) so it’s possible for those who aren’t tech savvy to set it up wrong.

Looks like it’s a for profit company so take a guess…

1000% this. Aftermarket, fucked colors, and/or no alignment is the cause of the problems. I would add that a lot of aftermarket lights are also way too bright. Sure, the owner can see (a tiny bit) better but everyone else gets blinded. Even then, it’s not bad unless they’re not aligned properly. (Well, it’ll still blind you if it’s a truck directly behind you but that’s just trucks.)

I’ve already addressed this but i guess i’ll expand on it.

Signal would not be able to add backdoors to all its users. Security researchers would see pretty quickly (more below) and that would be pretty big news because Signal is quite popular with people who care about their privacy.

They could in theory backdoor an individual’s Signal app but, again, that’s pretty inefficient. If anyone ever noticed it would be a big black mark against Signal, though they may not have much choice in the matter if it really came to it. However, we know that big governments and other sophisticated attackers usually prefer to just stick spyware on your phone. It’s easier, more comprehensive, and doesn’t require collaboration with Signal.

In contrast, you don’t need to do any of that with Telegram because it’s not E2EE. Your argument is basically “security features can be defeated by a sufficiently advanced attacker so use this other service that doesn’t have them to begin with.” This makes no fucking sense.

I don’t know what you’re talking about with FOSS stuff. Yeah, Telegram is open source. Signal is too. Some Signal forks (particularly the ones with “Signal” in their names) have been killed but others still exist, ex molly.im.

Signal client does have reproducible builds and has since 2016, as far as i know. This is another point against Signal being backdoored.

Beyond that, Signal has gone through a number of formal security audits. As far as i know, Telegram has not.

Finally, Telegram itself. Telegram could simply enable E2EE for all chats. They choose not to and that is concerning if you care about your privacy or security.

Yeah Signal could be better but that isn’t a case to use Telegram over Signal when Telegram is worse in almost every respect.

(Properly implemented E2EE is too difficult at the moment but those are some big caveats. Still: didn’t use Telegram.)

No, they cannot do it. That’s what E2EE means. It means they do not have the technological ability to do it. It is not possible.

Yes, even if a judge orders. You can see instances of that on their website: https://signal.org/bigbrother/

Yes there are weak points (the huge one with Signal being: requiring your cell phone number as a part of authentication) but that’s far beyond the level of technical expertise required to, say, just intercept clear text communications, ex from Telegram. If a government is wiretapping you then you’ve got problems that neither Signal nor Telegram can solve.

Now maybe you will suspect that a three letter agency will force them to do something bad, like send a suspect a hacked/backdoored version of the app or something but by and large i don’t think they would do that. They’d just go to Google or Apple and put a keylogger on your phone, or some other solution. Realistically, though, this is a level of effort far beyond what >99% of all humans need to worry about. Choosing Telegram over Signal because you’re afraid the government is manipulating your Signal app is a sign of incoherent paranoia.

A more serious concern would be, for example, the government capturing all data sent across the Internet and then holding onto it until some hypothetical future computer is developed that can just break the encryption. That’s still pretty silly but it’s something the US (at least) is doing. Still way beyond what they would need to get your Telegram messages because, again, they don’t need to decrypt those. They can just look.

The difference being: Signal cooperates as they’re legally required to buy do not have the technological capability to betray you. Telegram has the technological capability to betray you (and governments can spy on Telegram, with or without Telegram’s assistance) but refuses to cooperate.

Signal is much better and more reliable in this.

They can order Signal to turn over data (and the have) and signal has complied when it was legally required of them to do so, handing over all of their no data.

That’s the difference.

If that weren’t true they wouldn’t be so constantly upset about E2EE.

Specifically, they have the technological ability to prevent some crimes on their platform and have repeatedly refused to do so, or even engage with attempts to do so. Because they’re not E2EE they can see what everyone is doing and are therefore legally required to step in when someone is (for example) selling drugs on their platform.

Signal (etc) have no insight into the actions of their users and when they are legally required to take action they do, they take the minimal legally required action (unlike other services from, ex, Apple). Signal follows the law, Telegram does not.

States are really pissy about E2EE for this (and other) reasons. They want to get rid of it because they want to monitor all private conversations. That’s why E2EE is important.

It’s definitely not willfully ignorance given they collect the data.

I get it, i don’t want to live in China but i don’t want to live in whatever Elon Musk has planned for the US, either, and his wealth gives him undue influence over… pretty much everything. You’re not convincing me you’ve got a consistent take here if you’re cool with Twitter but not TikTok.

Yet nobody cares about US companies like Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube manipulating public opinion with their algorithms.